What's up with NYC tournaments? The pink elephant in the room

Once upon a time, two New York City tournaments were the crème de la crème for elite teams and talent in the northeast. For over two decades, iS8 based in South Jamaica and Rumble in the Bronx tournaments represented the proverbial rite of passage for the best of the best.

So dominant were these two events, that to this day, almost every NBA and/or college player from New York or New Jersey has probably participated in one or both iconic events. At their peak, no other tournament dared to even exist in their space and playing in the iS8 and the Rumble was considered mandatory to being deemed legit. So valued was winning championship hardware that forfeits were unheard of except by acts of God and pool play games were the stuff of legend only to be surpassed by the playoffs but all that has changed

Over the past few years, the iS8 and the Rumble in the Bronx’s space has been invaded by outside forces which include sneaker company teams and high school team based leagues like the Beacon 158, Tru-Ballaz H.S. Classic and the Police Athletic League. As a result, gone from the tournaments for the most part are many of the 17U elite teams including New Heights, the Rens, Playaz Club and others. There are now more and more pool play forfeits due to scheduling conflicts or travel and economic constraints and pool play games played are oftentimes lopsided and uninspiring. Everybody sees and is chattering about the "state of play" but no seems to be talking openly about the pink elephant in the room.

Because we value these two historic tournaments, NYCHoops.net decided to spark the conversation by talking to the directors of both the iS8 and the Rumble in the Bronx as well as the directors of some of the elite New York AAU/Travel programs who have been notoriously absent to find why there’s eroding support. The answers are obvious. The solutions, not so much.

One thing everyone seems to agree on as to why NYC tournaments have suffered in recently years is the advent of sneaker company leagues as opposed to camps. Originally Nike, Under Armour, Reebok and Adidas held one weekend per summer camps. Now they have leagues with national pool play events that last the entire summer and sneaker sponsored teams are required to participate in most of its events. This leaves less time and budget for teams to participate in local tournaments.

“The [sneaker] circuit has hurt the leagues,” said Pete Edwards who runs the iS8 Spring and Fall High School Classics. “Many teams go to the required tournaments, not to the local tournaments like they used to.” Edwards believes this shift has not only hurt tournaments like his but has also hurt the game. “You still get a lot if the players but not the teams.”

In an unprecedented move, the iS8 has in recent years been forced to suspend its tournament when it conflicts with sneaker company leagues dates or else lose the participation of players that are obligated to play for sneaker company teams. Compounding the problem and increasing the draw towards sneaker company leagues is that they mostly occur during the live periods whereas the iS8 and the Rumble in the Bronx do not. While Division II and III coaches can attend, the absence of Division I coaches becomes an issue.

Jim Hart, who’s the director of the Rumble in the Bronx, concurs with Edwards saying that the advent of the Sneaker Leagues has had a “massive impact” on his tournament but goes a bit farther. “The highest-level players that use to have a hand in making the iS8, making the Rumble in the Bronx, they’re given a schedule where if you’re a top 100 player, everyone’s coming at you whether it be USA basketball, foreign trips, EYBL, Under Armour Circuit, Adidas.” Hart says that where it used to be that teams only had one or two good players, the top 300 players all migrate to sneaker company sponsored teams.

During the iS8 and Rumble, there are some sneaker company teams participating but that ironically creates another unfortunate cascading dynamic that’s not fun for the fans, the players, or the teams. Pool play blowouts are prevalent where the loaded sneaker company teams are winning by 40 points over the B-teams and non-sneaker company teams.

“I just don’t wanna play three [pool play] games and beat teams by 30,” said Oz Cross with New Heights, an Under Amour team. “I miss iS8 and Rumble but it’s not worth it now.”

“That’s not the only factor,” said Andy Borman, the executive director for the New York Rens, a Nike team. “These kids do a ton of tourny’s with the High School or Community teams. Also, don’t forget, a ton of our kids are in multiple camps when they aren’t playing [Nike] EYBL.”

Borman added that even if the local tournaments were during the live period, the Rens could not attend unless it was a non-Nike weekend. The same holds true for the other sneaker company teams.

Since both the iS8 and Rumble in the Bronx are Nike sponsored events, Edwards believes that Nike could help to alleviate the problem. “Handlers of kids and the sneaker companies need to demand players play especially in events they sponsor. We’re supposed to be one family.”

Hart has a more pragmatic view saying, “Nike brand is the most powerful brand in sports. They’ve got 90% of the shoe market. They don’t have to adjust to make Pete happy or me happy. They’re throwing you a little product and you run your event and market the hell out of it yourself.” Whereas the iS8 and Rumble are open to everyone regardless to sneaker company affiliation, Hart says that sneaker companies make their exclusive events mandatory for its team.

So what’s the solution? Do local tournaments simply let the chips fall where they may or do they take measures to change the narrative. One New Yorker has managed to beat the odds and consistently attract top tier teams and talent but he does it in Nevada. Gary Charles, who runs the Fab 48 tournament, attributes his tournament's success partly with the event being held in Vegas and partly due to the relationships he’s created over the years. He also believes that incorporating a Super Pool Format has made his event more attractive.

“I thought Pete should have switched to a Super Pool Format years ago,” said Charles. “This would have helped to keep the top teams. Now with the escalating price all over the place people don’t want to come play or see 30 point blowouts.” Edwards doesn’t believe the solution is that simple. “You still have to get the teams.”

It’s clear that sneaker company teams are here to stay for the foreseeable future and that top tier players will migrate to those teams because of the overall level of talent, live period exposure and travel opportunities. It’s also clear that there are aren’t enough spots on these sneaker company teams to accommodate all the elite talent in the area so the task is to attract enough elite non-sneaker company teams and match them against other elite non-sneaker company teams during pool play. To be fair, the playoff rounds of each tournament this spring was quite competitive and did feature some of the more prominent players in the tri-state area.

“Grassroots basketball - it shifts,” said Hart. “Twenty years ago, there were [only] seven power teams and there were no other teams. Now there’s 300 teams in New York so its over-saturated. there’s too many teams.”

Hart believes that this too shall pass. “Eventually someone will say, do I need to pay $500 to go lose by 40 points for three games [in the iS8 or Rumble] or should I stick with my local league so you’ll see some of these smaller teams go away?” Once this happens Hart predicts the level of play should increase.

Bottom line? Hart says, “There’s always gonna be an iS8 and Rumble in the Bronx.”